tania
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Post by tania on Jan 25, 2013 14:57:16 GMT -5
After this episode, I might have to be done with TVD when the spin-off starts. The morality of the show has gone completely backwards. Kol is trying to prevent the destruction of the world and our main characters are using that as a reason to kill him. I can't deal with watching the "heroes" act like sacrificing innocent people because it suits their current goals makes them the good guys. At least with the Originals they're not that self-unaware of who they are. This is probably my biggest issue with the show right now. And I'm not sure if the writers themselves realize the hypocricy of the characters they write or not. There are no "good guys" and "bad guys" in TVD. There are protagonists and antagonists, people who are opposed to the protagonists. But neither side is "good" over the other. Everyone on this show is morally grey, it's just that some characters embrace it while some others delude themselves into believing that they're morally superior (when, in fact, they're not). This is the third time the MF group is happy to commit vampire genocide without caring about the thousands of innocents involved. They were cool with killing Klaus last season as long as he wasn't their sire, they were cool with killing Rebekah in 4x10 (even though Stefan had had a different opinion about it when Elena tried to do it six episodes ago : and now we have Elena and co trying to kill Kol and being totally cool about it. I'm mad at all of them. And no, sorry, but I can't root for these people. I can't root for these "protagonists". Is this even what Julie Plec wants me to do? I don't know anymore.
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Post by Mandy on Jan 25, 2013 15:36:06 GMT -5
After this episode, I might have to be done with TVD when the spin-off starts. The morality of the show has gone completely backwards. Kol is trying to prevent the destruction of the world and our main characters are using that as a reason to kill him. I can't deal with watching the "heroes" act like sacrificing innocent people because it suits their current goals makes them the good guys. At least with the Originals they're not that self-unaware of who they are. This is probably my biggest issue with the show right now. And I'm not sure if the writers themselves realize the hypocricy of the characters they write or not. There are no "good guys" and "bad guys" in TVD. There are protagonists and antagonists, people who are opposed to the protagonists. But neither side is "good" over the other. Everyone on this show is morally grey, it's just that some characters embrace it while some others delude themselves into believing that they're morally superior (when, in fact, they're not). This is the third time the MF group is happy to commit vampire genocide without caring about the thousands of innocents involved. They were cool with killing Klaus last season as long as he wasn't their sire, they were cool with killing Rebekah in 4x10 (even though Stefan had had a different opinion about it when Elena tried to do it six episodes ago : and now we have Elena and co trying to kill Kol and being totally cool about it. I'm mad at all of them. And no, sorry, but I can't root for these people. I can't root for these "protagonists". Is this even what Julie Plec wants me to do? I don't know anymore. Same here. I'm just not sure what we're supposed take away from it. Is it the sire bond? Is getting Damon un-compelled so important to her that killing all those vampires doesn't seem that big of a deal? Is it for Jeremy since he doesn't like doing it so many times? Is this just the "new vampire" Elena? It doesn't really matter me, I just don't like it. I'm sure some pro-Elena fans could argue how many innocents The Originals have killed (which they have!) but the big difference is that they don't pretend that it's the morally right thing. They don't act like the heroes. I find it hilarious that every single time they have to come crawling to Klaus for help, he has another attempted plot against him to use as leverage. They don't pretend to be anything other than what they are, which is why i can sit back and just enjoy them
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Post by Donna on Jan 25, 2013 15:51:48 GMT -5
Tania, you forgot about Damon pulling the invincible stake on Bek in 4x01 just before the council shot her through closed window blinds and took her into custody.
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tania
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Post by tania on Jan 25, 2013 16:04:54 GMT -5
Tania, you forgot about Damon pulling the invincible stake on Bek in 4x01 just before the council shot her through closed window blinds and took her into custody. See? They have tried so many times that I can't even remember all of them! ;D @mandy It's not just Elena that has issues though. Stefan and Caroline were perfectly ok with the genocide stuff in 4x10 as well...Elena is just the leader of the "kill Kol" campaign that's happening right now.
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sourwolf
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Klaus's loyal hybrid
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Post by sourwolf on Jan 25, 2013 16:25:27 GMT -5
After this episode, I might have to be done with TVD when the spin-off starts. The morality of the show has gone completely backwards. Kol is trying to prevent the destruction of the world and our main characters are using that as a reason to kill him. I can't deal with watching the "heroes" act like sacrificing innocent people because it suits their current goals makes them the good guys. At least with the Originals they're not that self-unaware of who they are. This is probably my biggest issue with the show right now. And I'm not sure if the writers themselves realize the hypocricy of the characters they write or not. There are no "good guys" and "bad guys" in TVD. There are protagonists and antagonists, people who are opposed to the protagonists. But neither side is "good" over the other. Everyone on this show is morally grey, it's just that some characters embrace it while some others delude themselves into believing that they're morally superior (when, in fact, they're not). This is the third time the MF group is happy to commit vampire genocide without caring about the thousands of innocents involved. They were cool with killing Klaus last season as long as he wasn't their sire, they were cool with killing Rebekah in 4x10 (even though Stefan had had a different opinion about it when Elena tried to do it six episodes ago : and now we have Elena and co trying to kill Kol and being totally cool about it. I'm mad at all of them. And no, sorry, but I can't root for these people. I can't root for these "protagonists". Is this even what Julie Plec wants me to do? I don't know anymore. That's been my impression too, that TVD doesn't have "good guys" or "bad guys". But then I see interviews with Julie where she calls Elena, Stefan, and Damon "heroes" and it makes me think the viewers are missing what she's trying convey in the show. I've never watched a show where the "heroes" were the ones openly laughing at someone wanting to prevent the end of the world. If Julie truly believes Elena's and the Salvatores' actions as of late are "heroic" then somebody needs to force her to watch a Buffy marathon so she can see real heroes.
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Post by Donna on Jan 25, 2013 19:24:35 GMT -5
Just got done watching online. Kol..Love him....I hope we get more of him. Damon: I've seen criticism of him online that he couldn't fight his compulsion and Stefan was able to resist Klaus' compulsion to hurt Elena. Also, some people didn't understand how Damon remembered when Kol compelled him to not remember. If I remember correctly, Stefan did bite Elena and chase her. Damon was trying very hard to fight his compulsion. I think he realized he must have been compelled because it he wouldn't have wanted to kill Jeremy otherwise. Still bothers me some how he talks to Jer, but I know others see it as how a big brother talks to a little brother. Also, why wasn't he on vervain? The council blew up a big bunch, but if random guy entering Shane's office had it in his blood, then it can be obtained somewhere. Elena: Yes, very irritating. I wonder if some of her behavior doesn't have to do with her sire bond. She has a desperate need to see her "sire" and figures she can't see him until his compulsion by Kol is released. She wants to keep Jeremy safe too. Her speech to Stefan was aggravating. It was like "I don't want you, but no one else can have you.". But you remember it wasn't that long ago she DID want him and chose him over Damon. Some wonder if that wasn't due to the sire bond. Why couldn't she be the one to snap Jeremy's neck to at least temporarily stop him? Why did she have to be the "damsel in distress" again? Klaus: No words necessary. Stebekah: I liked it..... Sorry, Kat. Bonnie: Some suggested Shane had made himself Bonnie's focus point, just like he asked Jeremy to have a focus point to calm himself down. I had to wonder. The camera was rolling when Liz left the room and was it still rolling when Bonnie was in the room. Only in MF would a teenager be allowed in with an suspect they are interrogating. And only in MF would a judge allow an arrest warrant for a group suicide. Rudy: Love him so much more than Abby. Stay away Abby. Matt: eh.... I do have to wonder if Stefan was right and there is another team wanting the cure and they were the ones that sent the random guy in to find the stone and chew off his tongue and kill himself so as not to reveal his secret. I've seen speculation online that the person at :15 with the sheathed dagger is in the mystery team. And they mystery person is Katherine. Would Elijah ever join a team? Rebekah's talk of teams had me .
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Post by Mandy on Jan 25, 2013 20:30:57 GMT -5
Donna, I think Elijah is "mystery Team". He's the only one left who can compel other vamps, right? Plus that random mention of him the same time we know there's someone else looking for the cure? I, for some reason, feel angrier toward Elena about the kill-an-original plan than I do Stefan and Caroline. Well, Stefan anyway. He didn't purposely come up with the plan. It was just an angry drunk reaction to Rebekah having taken Elena (whom he was furious at). As we've seen, when he's in his right mind, he doesn't condone killing them because of all the vampires it would kill. And as a Klaus stan, I can forgive angry rash decisions a little bit. Doesn't really work with Caroline, though, since her whole reason for going along with it was just because she didn't want Stefan drinking anymore. I really hope JP doesn't expect us to root for the MF gang in this plan, but the fact she routinely calls them the "heroes" makes me wonder.
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Post by Donna on Jan 25, 2013 20:40:55 GMT -5
Was the mystery man who chewed off his tongue a vamp? don't think so, since he killed himself with a metal knife didn't he?
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Post by Mandy on Jan 25, 2013 20:52:39 GMT -5
Was the mystery man who chewed off his tongue a vamp? don't think so, since he killed himself with a metal knife didn't he? Hmm, I don't know! I totally took him for a vampire for some reason. Could a human sit there while Rebekah cut him with knifes and then have the strength to just bite his tongue off?
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Post by Donna on Jan 25, 2013 20:55:32 GMT -5
Dunno. He was compelled to do whatever it took to not tell anyone why he was there. A human shouldn't be able to chew off his tongue without flinching first. I still think he's human since it wasn't wood that killed him. Unless I couldn't see well, but I thought that was a metal knife.
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Post by Mandy on Jan 25, 2013 21:40:22 GMT -5
Yeah, and he killed himself by sticking a knife in his throat. Don't think you can kill a vampire that way.
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Post by SireMe on Jan 25, 2013 23:35:50 GMT -5
Kat, I loved your recap! Dee, I noticed that you assumed it was Kol who sent that guy to Shane's office and had him compelled to kill himself if he got caught. I think it's someone else. Just how Stefan mentioned maybe there was another team out there. And then we got that mention of Elijah? ?? Who is the only other vampire out there who can compel another vampire. I think it's him. Well. I only assumed cause I figured, who else but OMK I hope it IS Elijah! That'd be an epic return.
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tania
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Post by tania on Jan 26, 2013 10:35:13 GMT -5
Kat, I loved your recap! Dee, I noticed that you assumed it was Kol who sent that guy to Shane's office and had him compelled to kill himself if he got caught. I think it's someone else. Just how Stefan mentioned maybe there was another team out there. And then we got that mention of Elijah? ?? Who is the only other vampire out there who can compel another vampire. I think it's him. Well. I only assumed cause I figured, who else but OMK I hope it IS Elijah! That'd be an epic return. Elijah sounds like a good option to me. Also, we know that he'll back in 4x16 and that his part in the storyline will be important. Thant makes the Elijah theory even more plausible.
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Post by snatcheaterase on Jan 27, 2013 15:59:28 GMT -5
I liked this episode. Bonnie was [censored] in the interrogation room, so if she does go dark this season I want more Bonnie like this episode. I think it'll be awesome.
Fighting compulsion is lame, and I think so for both Stefan and Damon. I can see if a normal vamp can compel them, I can see them fighting it. But come on, both have been compelled by Original Vamps, there should be no fighting at all. I'm glad Damon failed to fight it, I wouldn't want him to be lame. Don't get me wrong, I actually liked the SE scene in s3, up until they went OTT with it to show how epic they are.
And Damon is my fave character, but how was he able to remember Kol compelling him? Kol specifically said he wouldn't remember the conversation, but lo and behold he does. Can we not have any more fighting compulsion stuff from anyone? Please?
Like I said before, more [censored] Bonnie please. I hope she is the one to kill Shane. It seems like he has complete control over her by saying one simple phrase or word, and he can make her do anything, and that's gross.
Stefan and Rebekah worked great as a team. I really wasn't looking forward to, or even wanted Stebekah sex. The sex was lame, imo, and wasn't crazy at all like they kept mentioning. Plus I laughed at how quickly it cut off. There was way more sexual tension in Shane's office between the two.
I didn't get the line at the end from Stefan. Or why people was praising him or whatever? Didn't that line mean he was basically pretending to be a different person in the SE relationship? Or maybe I understood it wrong?
But yeah, I liked that this episode wasn't focused on the triangle so much.
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Post by snatcheaterase on Jan 28, 2013 1:23:20 GMT -5
What do you guys think of this fighting compulsion stuff. I was under the impression that both Stefan and Damon ultimately tried and failed to resist it fully. But there are people saying that Damon wasn't able to fight it for his precious Elena, but Stefan not only fought it off but had to be compelled three times for it to take effect. I went back and watched SE's and he did have to get compelled three times.
So does him getting compelled three times show he was able to fight it off? Do you guys see Stefan as fighting the compulsion off completely? I thought both was similar in that, both tried to resist and fight it, but eventually would have did it anyway.
My question is, do you guys think Stefan was able to successfully fight off Klaus compulsion in s3?
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